16 replies to this topic

[Fuzzy]

Since gettin back I've been re-evaluating my whole stand point on my approach to space marine as a whole, community and game. I've come to a subject in my ponderings that I cannot decide an answer to:

Is it better to play to win or play for the hell of it?

I can see both sides of it and can't decide which I agree with.

The play to win side I see because what's the point in doing anything unless you're going to go all out? I also see that it was the approach I took before leaving and look where that got me. I also see that most people that take that approach while dedicated to the game more than most are in my opinion complete ass holes.

The play for the hell of it side I see the view of "it's just a game" which I agree with whole heartedly but at the same time I also look and see most of the guys with that view have hardly any dedication in comparison with the former and are usually at the level of play that would earn them C-team status and maybe B-team at a push but hardly ever top tier players.

So anyway my question is this: Is it better to play to win it play for the hell of it?

[CruciasNZ]

I am of the opinion that it's best to enjoy the game. Though I try very hard to win, using sneaky unexpected tactics anytime possible because they fail a lot but the WIN when they work is worth it (think attacking Scorpion Tanks on Halo with the Gravity Hammer).

I consider it a major failure if you get to the top of the scoreboards by standing on the backs of others. "Win at all cost" attitudes can make you the most successful players in a game (or anything for that matter), but they'll never make you the best.

Teams which are basically douchebags tend to get shunned and left out of events; there's always people who hate loosing and avoid playing better teams, but there's a hell of a lot more people who just blacklist elitist douchebags because they ruin the game for everyone. Obviously this doesn't matter for large mainstream games, such as COD, Halo, BF and League of Legends, but for small niche games it can lead to game starvation.

Fortunately they're really really easy to spot, they're the ones saying "learn to play noob" and strutting around saying "no one has the balls to play us" instead of admitting they fucked up and everyone despises them as individuals, not players. On my Warhammer Online server there was a guild that styled themselves the best PVP team, they organized massive raids to take the castles from the other faction; sadly they were a bunch of elitist douchebags and eventually no-one on the server would back them up, or invite them to our raid events. Pretty much the same story repeated on both the Aion and Rift servers I played on as well.

In the end you should play the way YOU want to because it's a game and its primary reason for existence is entertainment. We less-hardout players just don't have to invite you to our BBQ's. Hopefully Eternal Crusade is large enough that both schools of thought can co-exist without as much friction as there is/was on Space Marine - really really hoping that game doesn't flop!

[Fuzzy]

As always cru, thankyou for the thought out and reasoned answer. If I'm reading it correctly what you're saying is that playing to win is fine so long as you aren't a complete dickhead about it?

And the pattern of the nothing matters but the win players you pointed out is one of the things that made me decide to re-evaluate in the first place. I didn't want to be counted among those that ruin a game that people enjoy.

[CruciasNZ]

As always cru, thankyou for the thought out and reasoned answer. If I'm reading it correctly what you're saying is that playing to win is fine so long as you aren't a complete dickhead about it?

Yeah basically. I can't tell you how to find or toe the line between winning a lot and still being awesome, and just being a dork; it's just one of those things everyone has their own "bar" for.

Also there's a difference between 'E-Sports' and 'Gaming'. The first you can be douchebags in because you're being PAID to play better and/or worse teams. The second is what I was talking about, also when people think they belong in category 1 but are playing a category 2 game or game-mode.

And the pattern of the nothing matters but the win players you pointed out is one of the things that made me decide to re-evaluate in the first place. I didn't want to be counted among those that ruin a game that people enjoy.

Just remember that you cannot always please everyone either. This is one of those messed up things in life that is never clearly defined and can fuck everything up if you get it wrong.

[DusteirTax]

As always cru, thankyou for the thought out and reasoned answer.

This is because he is Malcador's successor

[CruciasNZ]

As always cru, thankyou for the thought out and reasoned answer.

This is because he is Malcador's successor

Assassin more like Yes successor

[An_A10_Pilot]

I find that line is often a very blurry one. I most find 2-3 people who's opinon i care about and other people's can pretty much buzz off.

[Opeth Of Epica]

Play to have fun.

Being competive makes you an bitter and angry asshole, I'm a prime example.

[JC 042]

I play for the hell of it and still come out on top a couple of times. It's just that people who play to win train to be better players and often come out on top than those who play for fun.

I also hate the people on World of Tanks who say "GG, I had a fail team" when they themselves only got 1 kill that they stole. In fact that happens at least once EVERY game of World of Tanks

[Opeth Of Epica]

I also hate the people on World of Tanks who say "GG, I had a fail team" when they themselves only got 1 kill that they stole. In fact that happens at least once EVERY game of World of Tanks

GG!

[CruciasNZ]

I also hate the people on World of Tanks who say "GG, I had a fail team" when they themselves only got 1 kill that they stole. In fact that happens at least once EVERY game of World of Tanks

and when you have drunk people who drive tanks into lakes and rivers. Gawd but they're obnoxious

[Opeth Of Epica]

and when you have drunk people who drive tanks into lakes and rivers. Gawd but they're obnoxious

It could be worse........

You could be playing with drunk teammates on Battlefield.

[Authrix]

If there's nothing important on the line, I'd vote play for fun. The fact with Space Marine is that you're likely to be in a lobby with randoms. Anyone can win with a WAAC loadout and tryhard mode engaged. Crushing people like that is fun for a few people, but I would disagree.

[Fuzzy]

and when you have drunk people who drive tanks into lakes and rivers. Gawd but they're obnoxious

It could be worse........

You could be playing with drunk teammates on Battlefield.

Are you referring to when we played the BF4 Beta?

[Opeth Of Epica]

Are you referring to when we played the BF4 Beta?

No although one guy pretty much set the world record for levels of derp.

[Fuzzy]

You'll have to tell me when I get on bud

[Prosperan Son]

I'll try to explain my thoughts on both sides as best as I can.

The play to win side I see because what's the point in doing anything unless you're going to go all out? I also see that it was the approach I took before leaving and look where that got me. I also see that most people that take that approach while dedicated to the game more than most are in my opinion complete ass holes.

It is completely true, that most people that take this path end up becoming Complete Assholes as we've seen in the past with numerous groups of people and single individuals. This is for the Mainstream competitive Players that enjoy winning and do whatever it takes to reach the top. But I've always had the belief that once you reach the top? What else is there to do? A Saying that comes to mind is " That the Road to Hell is Paved with Good Intentions." The Clans and Singular Individuals that get to the top usually end up with a large ego, and more often than not will find themselves hated or ignored by everyone else. It ends up becoming a lonely road, and I do my best to avoid this path and the people that follow this path, not out of fear, but because I find their methods and attitudes intolerable. I've never believed in their being a "Best or Top-Ranked" Group because several clans have claimed to be such and have only ever collapsed in the end.

The play for the hell of it side I see the view of "it's just a game" which I agree with whole heartedly but at the same time I also look and see most of the guys with that view have hardly any dedication in comparison with the former and are usually at the level of play that would earn them C-team status and maybe B-team at a push but hardly ever top tier players.

This is the view that I go with. And this is the view that I tried to instill into the Black Templars when I was the High-Marshal and currently into the Word Bearers as their Grand Apostle. I don't care about winning or losing, and I try to ensure that my guys don't either. Videogames in my opinion were created to entertain and allow interaction between different kinds of people and what better play to do this then in a Clan? This is why I've made the Clan and I believe that all Clans should act as havens for people with similar interest and beliefs to enjoy a game together then alone. There have been occasions where I've enjoyed a loss against another Clan simply because of their similar mindsets and both sides were playing for the hell of it, winning was not a priority. I've avoided much Drama as a whole, thanks to this style, and I've made many great friends, and learned many things outside of the game from my group. At the same time, I've lost good friends who adopted the former belief of winning at all cost, because their presence simply became insufferable.